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Scrolls, potions, and items.

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GLIPP
LessRudeScrib
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Scrolls, potions, and items. Empty Scrolls, potions, and items.

Post  LessRudeScrib Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:41 am

How do we keep these from breaking the game?
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Post  GLIPP Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:43 am

1) Remove fortify (skill) to prevent alchemy bullshit.

Should be downhill from there.

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Post  Rainbay Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:45 am

Haha! I have seperate tabs for each thread that updates alot, so I saw this new one, opened a new tab. Then I decided we had to many tabs open at once, so I was trying to decide which one to close. Went ot my "Fan-wank" tab, saw a new post in the NPC's thread, and saw you realise about the scrolls. Awesome

We could make it so you are only allowed to have one scroll or one potion on at a time. Or that they don't stack, only increase the length of the effect if two potions or scrolls or spells have the same effect.

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Post  Rainbay Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:48 am

GLIPP wrote:1) Remove fortify (skill) to prevent alchemy bullshit.

Should be downhill from there.

It was actually fortify intelligence that gave the alchemy bullshit, since fortify skills were nearly impossible to get. And fortifying attributes is a very useful and important thing, I wouldn't like it to be removed completely. Just find a way to prevent it from being abused. Maybe make it so no attribute could reach beyond double it's base value without boosts? Still strong, but it puts a limit on things.

I'm sad that all this would stop my exploitive super munchkin Personality beast setup though

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Post  LessRudeScrib Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:48 am

How about offensive scrolls/effects?

Really, this is just a reskinned version of the problem of why have a rogue when you can buy or find like 80 scrolls of Elkash' lock splitter?
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Post  Rainbay Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:51 am

Perhaps make it so when you cast from scrolls, there is still a chance of failure somehow? The bonus from the scroll would be not needing to expend any magicka on the spell, and not being able to be silenced or Sounded when casting it from the scroll.

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Post  LessRudeScrib Sat Mar 06, 2010 1:06 am

We still need to adjust to a party-based game, I think is the bigger point. In Morrowind, at least, you could cover just about any contingency with extra scrolls. But here, we've got teammates, so we need to rebalance magic.
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Post  Rainbay Sat Mar 06, 2010 1:38 am

LessRudeScrib wrote:We still need to adjust to a party-based game, I think is the bigger point. In Morrowind, at least, you could cover just about any contingency with extra scrolls. But here, we've got teammates, so we need to rebalance magic.

I've been thinking about this, how to cover spells you want to affect the whole party without affecting the enemy, or spells you want to affect the enemy without affecting the party.

For instance, some way of casting an intervention spell on the whole party. Or levitate, or jump, or just about anything. I suppose recall would work instead of intervention, since it would take you to your marks, and if your enemy didn't have one, they wouldn't go with you.

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Post  Saint Jiub Sat Mar 06, 2010 1:43 am

I think that might be something you need to learn Thaumaturgy to take advantage of. Most spells in TES don't let you get all selective with your targets the way D&D does with Allies Only spells or Enemies Only. I say unless you're a skilled architect of Magicka, AoE spells just burst where you tell them to, and you hope you don't accidentally heal your arch-nemesis.
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Post  Rainbay Sat Mar 06, 2010 1:48 am

Saint Jiub wrote:I think that might be something you need to learn Thaumaturgy to take advantage of. Most spells in TES don't let you get all selective with your targets the way D&D does with Allies Only spells or Enemies Only. I say unless you're a skilled architect of Magicka, AoE spells just burst where you tell them to, and you hope you don't accidentally heal your arch-nemesis.

Haha! Perfect! That makes Thaumaturgy truly deserve to be a prestige skill alright.
Isn't it great how some things just end up working out?

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Post  Dagoth Durr Sat Mar 06, 2010 7:33 am

I think the scroll thing could be fixed just by making them very rare and expensive to produce.

For potions, I liked the idea someone broached in another thread, about negative side effects. Either make it so consuming multiple potions at once really fucks you up, or make each potion have a small negative side effect so you have to use them strategically.
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Post  Slotha Sil Sat Mar 06, 2010 10:06 am

In game, scrolls and potions were broken because you had infinite mounds of glod at your disposal and could brew potions instantly, all the while becoming a genius. Alchemy won't be able to work that way in PnP unless your game master is Robot Snape who likes awarding XP for hours of nothing but alchemy rolls. Gold can be limited - we're building this thing from scratch, we have carte blanche to decide how easily it will be to grind daedric ruins for 50,000 septim drops, and how easily they can be sold. Hoarding artifacts should be a big, big no-no, according to in-game books (provided that you manage to find one, which in itself ought to be a campaign-grade undertaking). Scrolls are specially treated pieces of paper capable of holding not only a spell, but also magicka needed to juice it, and often more than a mediocre mage could squeeze out of himself between rests. Scrolls can easily be ten times more expensive than they were in the game.

Scrolls and potions need to be present, but would fit better as expensive and powerful backup options than as common gear. And making them would take days or weeks and require craft rolls.
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Post  Rainbay Sat Mar 06, 2010 11:40 am

Enchanted items too, I suppose. Those were very useful in the game, acting as a sort of magicka battery, allowing you to cast spells with an item in your inventory instead of using up the magicka you had.
So I'm alright with making potions and scrolls more expensive, but don't make them too expensive as to overpower the enchantment skill. A simple way to do this is to make enchanted items even MORE expensive, since they require not only special preparation and magicka from the mage, but a creatures SOUL as well. They could be given out as quest rewards and such. For instance, the party is doing a difficult quest for the temple, and are all given a small supply of potions and an intervention scroll each. If they are successful in the quest, they might be rewarded with an enchanted item that will allow them to use the intervention spell whenever they please. Just a thought.
We can't make it too difficult to enchant though; I'd like all 3 "crafting" skills to be ranked at about the same difficulty for the same level of task.

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